What does it mean to be mindful? Is mindfulness a mindset, a way of life or is it a practice? Is mindfulness congruent with religion or meditation? Is mindfulness hard? Host Mike Domitrz welcomes CAST members Alan Anderson, Barry Moniak, and Holly Duckworth to explore common myths surrounding mindfulness and to share how mindfulness myths have affected their lives.
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Mike Domitrz:
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Hello. Yes, I’m your host Mike Domitrz and thrilled to be here with our cast from the Every Day Mindfulness Show. This week’s cast includes Alan Anderson, Barry Moniak and Holly Duckworth. You can learn all about them and check out our brilliant cast on our website at everydaymindfulnessshow.com. That’s everydaymindfulnessshow.com.
We’re gonna dive right in to our very first question and our first question today … and I’m gonna start with you Holly if that’s okay. The first question is what is the biggest myth you hear surrounding mindfulness. Because for everyone listening today, today’s show is about Mindfulness Myth Busters. We gonna burst the myth surrounding mindfulness. So Holly, what is the biggest myth you hear surrounding mindfulness?
Holly Duckworth:
Well, mike thanks for having me on the show. Myths On mindfulness, one of the big ones that I hear from my friends and family and certainly my clients is, “Oh my gosh if I step into a mindfulness practice is going to take more time. I don’t have time to be mindful.” And in my mindfulness practice I actually pride my self on integrating it into the life that I already live. So yes, I do have a few moments in the morning that I do my meditation in that type of practice.
But I think it’s also important for people to understand that mindfulness can be integrated into your life. If I’m driving down the road I might take a breath at a stop sign and just become fully present with my car at a stop sign. So that’s a big myth for me. It’s around you know, “Mindfulness takes more time and I think we need to look at ways we can sip our coffee or become fully present in a conversation to bring mindfulness into our everyday awareness.”
Mike Domitrz:
Holly, I love that. I love that idea that it’s throughout the day. So you sat at a stop sign while you’re living your everyday life. What do you mean by your being mindful for those listening, what are you doing in those moments whether is it 30 seconds, is it one minute, is it five minutes, how does that present itself?
Holly Duckworth:
Again just in my practice, mindfulness. I try to be as free flowing with it. So is fewer expectations that I can let off my mindfulness practice, the more present I can be in the present moment. So in that example in the car, we’ve all driven our cars and sometimes we sit at a stop light for five minutes. And in that five minutes I’m breathing, I’m present in my car, I might be listening to a calming piece of music, but I’m not texting, I’m not on my phone, I’m not looking at the GPS, I’m fully present at my car waiting being present in that stop sign.
My mindfulness practice in the morning, I may sit on my meditation pillow for 30 minutes. But I think letting go some of the Myths of mindfulness are giving yourself permission to create a practice that works for you, whether that’s 30 seconds 5 times a day or 30 minutes twice a day.
Mike Domitrz:
Yeah, I love that. Alan, Barry, how do you find that you try to address that same issue with that time? Because, people do have this … I mean this is a major myth, I hear it all the time too, “I don’t have time for that.” Or some will … oh that’s a different myth I’ll go into later. Somebody will say to me, “Well if I do, then I’ll just go to sleep,” that’s a different myth, so we’ll address that a little bit later ’cause it falls into their time concept of, “I don’t have time for that but I do for a nap,” you know that kind of thing.” So do find that same thing and what are ways you address the myth of time?
Alan Anderson:
Well, yeah I agree with everything that Holly said. I think it‘s really important that one is able to switch from a formal mindfulness practice to applied mindfulness to applied mindfulness practice in every situation. So whether it’s in the car or having a sip of coffee or doing the dishes, to be able to say, “I’m going to extend mindfulness into all of these moments of my life.”
So I think that’s really helpful. I try to do the very same thing for myself, so I think that’s really … it’s an essential key. However, I would just also add that in order to do that, to have that applied mindfulness. I think it’s so essential that you have some kind of formal understanding of it as the basis.
Because I’ve been a musician in my lifetime, I like to think about what it’s like to practice music and then to play it. So kind of as Holly said, “If you’re able to let things go and let things be free.” I think it needs an essential core but at least understanding what the practice is and what’s it about. So I agree with Holly and I think that basis is the extraordinarily important as well.
Barry Moniak:
I would concur with that Allan, this is Barry. I love the analogy of the difference between practicing and playing. A couple two, three years ago mindfulness wasn’t a thing. Nobody knew about it, nobody was talking about it unless you’re going into some very old [inaudible 00:05:54] Tibetan-type of writings.
Mindfulness is the state of being, it’s the state of awareness, it’s a state of consciousness, a state of presence. So now it’s being deemed this practice. The practice of mindfulness isn’t mindfulness in my perception. Mindfulness is the way you show up, the way you go about doing whatever it is you’re doing.
The more you’re paying attention, the more present you are, the more mindful you are, anything that helps that happen, that’s a part of the practice that makes the playing more effective.
Mike Domitrz:
So is this a chicken before the egg thing, the egg before the chicken thing? Because you bring up an interesting discussion, which I’ve heard people have before. Barry, which is, “It’s a mindset, it’s a belief, it’s a way of life versus it’s a practice.” And I know there are some authors and experts who say, “No, it’s a practice.” And one requires the other but, which comes first? And so to get to that place Barry, doesn’t this go back to what Alan said, “You have to practice to get to the mindset?
Barry Moniak:
Yes, and I would take the belief part out of it. Whoever is throwing that into the mix is just muddying the waters. Mindfulness has nothing to do with belief, it has everything to do with cognizance. How aware are you of who you are, how you’re showing up, how you’re affecting or influencing people or the environment around you that is part of mindfulness.
Any practice that helps that happen is essential. Just like you can’t teach someone a language without breaking down the alphabet, words and phrases, you can’t expect them to just jump in and be able to speak a foreign language if they haven’t been given the tools.
Mike Domitrz:
So you’re saying that it’s not a practice but you must practice?
Barry Moniak:
Yes. A good way of putting it, yes.
Mike Domitrz:
Okay awesome. So let’s stay with you Barry. What’s another major myth that you hear with mindfulness?
Barry Moniak:
Well, a lot of people seem to be associating mindfulness, this new thing with positivity and light, and being in the light and staying in the light. And it just kind of irks me because reality as we know it is made up of positive and negative light and dark. And yet people keep wanting to lean towards, “oh I only wanna … I don’t wanna listen to the news ’cause there’s so much negativity.” Excuse me it’s reality, it’s really happening, and if you’re not paying attention to what is really happening, then you’re not helping things move forward.
So the mindful people again from my perspective are the ones looking at reality and going, “Okay, how can I best position myself and how can I best be of influence to help the larger picture move forward?”
Holly Duckworth:
Yeah, I would to that. It’s about a [beingness 00:08:54] versus a [doingness 00:08:57].
Barry Moniak:
Absolutely.
Holly Duckworth:
Am I going to be doing mindfulness, which is like doing a task, like doing an email or am I going to be more mindful in the way I express myself and quite frankly receive those people into my life in various exchanges we have during the day. So for me, I can really connect to what you’re saying about it, it’s both a practice and a living it because there’s many many times that I have to get back in the grace of, “Okay wait a second, I’m not fully present in this moment. I’m not mindful.” It’s not just the listening to a person but it’s being energetically in resonance with them.
Barry Moniak:
I remember a long long time ago, I came across this information about, “What state of mind are you in when you’re preparing food for other people?” That’s really interesting. So I got into it and then I experimented a little bit ’cause I love cooking for other people.
And sometimes I put together an amazing meal but I was just developing to the news there, kind of thinking about whatever I was doing and it was what it was. Then I tried something with very simple ingredients, not a lot of spice or flavor, but I was just really concentrating on how much kind of loving, nurturing energy could I put into this food that other people were gonna partake of.
And they went crazy for it, they thought it was the best thing they had ever eaten. And it didn’t have that doingness that you’re talking about, it didn’t have all those spices and ingredients. It had that different energy and people somehow were able to pick up on it.
Holly Duckworth:
I think that leans to another myth, which is mindfulness has to be heard.
Mike Domitrz:
Well, I think that that myth comes from … they believe it’s hard to quiet their mind. And that goes back to another myth of, “It has to be positivity or it has to be perfectly silence.” You know those type of a thing. There’s so many myths overlapping here. But I think that idea that it has to be heard is the quiet the mind myth.
Alan Anderson:
I think one thing that’s also kind of helpful to us it’s a lovely boon in a sense is that in order to … it’s not even a project to have to do these things just like Barry’s speaking about with the cooking or whatever. In truth, we have mindfulness, it’s happening constantly. It really doesn’t stop.
I think the difficulty they have is understanding that we’re working with our own distraction that’s part of the mindfulness thing. Probably the most essential thing I think of mindfulness is the ability to come back when you do get distracted. It’s kind of like the dark and the light etc.
But I think that in order for us to really appreciate mindfulness, we can realize that right now I’m looking at my window, and you know what? I’m listening what’s going on. My eyes are on the beautiful green leaves out there. All these things are going on, so we’re constantly there, we’re constantly mindful. It’s a matter knowing how to work that in some sense ’cause it’s already happening.
Barry Moniak:
Yeah, I think mindfulness has gotten associated with quiet, stillness, and again that’s something that I think is very beneficial for people to experience. But I don’t know that when you’re sitting in absolute silence and stillness that you’re necessarily being mindful, you’re just being still.
When you get up and start moving, that’s when the [mindness 00:12:31] kicks in for me. So I look at that image of the Masai warrior standing on one foot all night long, paying attention to everything, so that if anything is gonna harm the village, they can let them know. That’s a very different state of meditation or stillness. There’s still a whole lot going on. So, that’s kind of my mental imagery icon of mindfulness. How much I’m I really aware of and are there things off my radar screen because I’m just not looking or paying attention.
Alan Anderson:
I like that image a lot, and I’d like to add another one. So I think images are really powerful teachers. They aren’t so intellectual, they really help us. So I think the Masai warrior was great. And one that’s used in the tradition I study in Shambhala Buddhism, is the image of the tiger. And this is ancient imagery. You can see it temples in Bhutan. It’s been there for thousands of years. A series called tiger [inaudible 00:13:33] dragon.
And the tiger part is the mindfulness part. There you have the same kind of mindfulness as the tiger going through the jungle, feeling everything on its paws, feeling every breeze of air on it’s every hair, sense of sound, like that kind of presence kind of just very simple, not complicated but all together there with feet on the ground, eyes open, ears open. So very much connecting to senses too, which I think helps overcome the myth that mindfulness is some kind of intellectual exercise.
Mike Domitrz:
Well and I think that works really well with the myth that mindfulness is meditation, right? That they are one and the same. And so if I cannot think or if I cannot be quiet without thoughts coming in my head, I’m failing. And so they look at that and go, “Well, and I think that works really well with the myth that mindfulness is meditation, right?” That they are one and the same, and so if I cannot think or if I cannot be quiet without thoughts coming in my head, I’m failing, and so they look at that and go, “Well, no, that’s natural for thoughts to come to your head.”
But this idea of the myth of what meditation is, and then meditation equals mindfulness, so if I struggle to have a quiet mind then I can’t be mindful, which is not true at all. Now becoming mindful helps you with that mind, with that busy mind, but it doesn’t have to be one before the other, you can work both at the same time
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Holly Duckworth:
There’s a myth we’re dancing with a little bit here that mindfulness often gets married up to a religious institution, religious practice and I’m grateful that you shared how you connect the two for you but I also … for listeners, I always like to speak the additional experience that you don’t have to have a religious tradition. While they often work together for some people, if you choose not to participate in a religious tradition, you can also choose to be mindful. I hope that came out correctly.
Barry Moniak:
Yes, that’s where I was going Holly, is there’s people who walk around, I think with a chip on their shoulder that because they belong to some theosophy, that that makes them mindful and it’s like no, it just makes you remember that particular group. Now if there’s something in that involvement that helps you become more mindful, that’s great but it doesn’t necessarily make it so. There’s people who think that because they’re vegetarian or vegan or because they do a lot of yoga, because they do Qi Gong and all these wonderful things, that that makes them mindful, well not until they apply it did you get anything out of those experiences that helps you be more mindful.
Mike Domitrz:
And on the flip side of that Barry, is the discussion that some people think “I don’t have time for mindfulness,” but they pray every day, and they pray in a way that is mindful, but they’re not aware of what mindfulness is, you know? I mean that’s the irony of it. There are people who pray simply for self wants, and they don’t even recognize that and that’s not a place of mindfulness, unless it’s intentionality that you’re working on, like you wanna bring positivity.
But if it’s about help this, help that, but it’s about materialism or individual wants, that’s a different kind of prayer, but there’s that person who prays for, “Let me be able to let go of the things I cannot control, and let me have faith,” that comes from a place of resting the mind, of grounding yourself, very mindful, but that same person will be like, “I don’t believe in that stuff,” when you talk about mindfulness, but yet they’re praying in away that’s mindfulness.
So it’s just … you’re sitting there going, “Wow, this is just a misperception, they don’t understand the mindfulness concept of it.
Barry Moniak:
And even more, so if I know that you just had an injury, an accidents, a surgery, maybe there’s something going on in your family dynamic and I’m sending you prayers, loving helpful supportive energy, that things go well, that’s being extremely mindful, ’cause I’m participating in your reality. I think if more people did that, the world would be a better place.
Mike Domitrz:
Yes, being mindful can be sending the energy, right? So, some people say, “I am saying a prayer for you,” other people say, “I am sending this form of energy to you.” It’s the same mindfulness ironically, it’s language that they’re really changing.
Alan Anderson:
I’ve been paying attention a lot to different brain researchers that have been working with mindfulness and coming with amazing discoveries. So, one person is really love is Daniel Goleman, the author of Emotional Intelligence, and I heard a wonderful talk by him and he was talking about how mindfulness is great, but it’s not everything. And that we need really emotional intelligence in order to make mindfulness work. So, his claim is that, it’s very powerful, mindfulness, but not in every way claimed and he feels like it’s kind of oversold a little bit.
So, he talks about some very interesting like, “You can be as mindful as you wanna be, but if you have no sense of how to work with contact management, you’re gonna be … it could be terrible at contact management and still be mindful. You could be a person who is able to pay very close attention but doesn’t know how to seize an opportunity. He’s talking about leadership actually in this situation, but I think for all of us, we’re leaders in some way, right? Like just having a conversation, we can lead by example, being a parent is being a leader. So, there’s all the different ways that mindfulness shows up, and how we react with one another, and I think there’s this big difference between the emotional intelligence and emotional hijacking that happens in the fight or fly part of the brain.
So, if that’s happening a lot then our mindfulness doesn’t really measure up to a lot if we’re not able to work that into other aspects of how we manage our own emotions, our own awareness of our self, knowing how other people see us as opposed to how we just see ourselves, I think it’s just so … an incredible amount of different ways that we can actually integrate that mindfulness into being a really decent human being to one another.
Mike Domitrz:
Well, I think you’re bringing up something really important, what was the … I can’t believe I’m forgetting ’cause I bought the book for tons of people, but the book out about six years ago, now that everybody is … The Secret, there we go. In The Secret, there is one piece missing in the video version, I did not read the book, I watched the video, and that was the work, right?
So, the video version, which I loved, but that something’s missing here, and it would say, well, if I was intentional and thought that parking space is gonna be there for me, the parking space is more likely to be there for me, and if I was intentional that way, the world would come to my ways. But there was missing one part that if I’m intentional, and I work to make those things happen, it was missing that part, which you’re bringing up. It can’t just be intentionality, you have to build skills to do things, to make yourself better that … just like mindfulness.
If I just say, “I’m gonna be more mindful,” but I don’t actually work on that at all, and understand the skill sets that help me get there, it’s more a statement than a reality. And so, I think that becomes really important to people to be able to discuss, what are you doing, actual doing to make this become reality?
Barry:
It’s interesting because a number of years ago, I was at an event, a conference where Jack [Hanfield 00:21:31] had won an award. And afterwards, there was a banquet or something, and I had an opportunity to talk to him, and I asked him about that. I said, “There’s people running around that have this idea, ‘If I just write it down on a piece of paper and stick it on my refrigerator, any day now it’s gonna show up.'” He goes, “I know, and they’re not listening to everything I’m saying, because I can tell you from the day I put it on the refrigerator, every single thing I thought, felt and did, that now 20 years later I’m receiving this reward or award and I’m not surprised because I know what I did to make it happen. They just jump for the note on the refrigerator to winning the award, and leave out all the in between.” And I went, “Interesting, awesome.”
Holly Duckworth:
But to that idea of work again, I think that we have a whole show on what’s mindful work? ‘Cause I think part of that is the mindful allowing that in the case of Jack Hanfield, he had to allow himself to open up to meet the people he needed to meet, to say the things he needed to say, to write what he needed to write but we think of … Again, work sometimes falls into doing versus being or becoming that which you seek to be mindful and both give to the world and receive into your world.
Mike Domitrz:
Well, and that’s the integration, that if you’re really being, it affects what you’re doing.
Holly Duckworth:
Yeah.
Mike Domitrz:
And so, it’s not that they’re separate, it’s that they integrate together.
Holly Duckworth:
Just like the cooking example.
Mike Domitrz:
Yes.
Barry Moniak:
Yes.
Mike Domitrz:
Right.
Barry Moniak:
Yeah, somebody can do something differently, but not necessarily be anymore mindful. If they’re paying attention to the mindfulness of the way they’re doing it, now they can change something internally, and do the same exact thing, but produce a different result.
Mike Domitrz:
I love it. Let’s jump into a new myth, the myth that if I work on mindfulness, and take time to sit down and be quiet, I will fall asleep. Like, I have a friend, and I know this friend is listening right now, so, she’s gonna get a kick out of this. But the joke with her family is that, “Hey, mom was meditating again, we caught her napping,” and she’ll laugh that at the end of her meditation she [inaudible 00:23:48] off, that type of thing. But there’s this stereo type although that that’s what’s going to happen, if I meditate, I’m really just gonna fall asleep.
Barry Moniak:
It’s a phase, it’s initial thing in esoteric training, esoteric meditative training, they talk about the Koong Joong effect, that when the mind gets to a certain level of frequency for a lack of a better language, that we’re not used to or accustomed to, it’s easy for us to nod out and then come back and go, “Whoa, where did I just go? What just happened?” The more we practice that, the more we’re able to hold an attention and awareness or focus while we are still. Those are all skills that will only behoove someone if they use them properly or effectively.
Alan Anderson:
in the Indian Tibetan tradition, there’s a whole list of things called obstacles and antidotes where they point out with pretty clear, pretty good accuracy what are the things that can be distracting to us, perhaps distraction or sleepiness. And they have antidotes for them. And it’s funny, ’cause some of the antidotes show up in the same things that we’ve learned about, for instance breath work, that people use like how to breath at this time, or if you’re falling asleep, to stop meditating, take a breath right there, and straighten up your posture, if you’re doing formal practice, straighten up your posture, and look out and just give yourself a moment to say, “Okay, I wanna start afresh, I wanna start again.”
So, I think what happens a lot is when we fall asleep, we think that’s the end of it, but we should expect it. Falling asleep does come with it, boredom does come with it. This all comes together so to have some kind of tool box, is kind of large. You know that you can know what kind of breathing to use, and what did you do with your posture, things like that. I think all those things can very helpful in allowing, getting yourself to wake up and not just go into some kind of dreams state.
Holly Duckworth:
Accept yourself and bless yourself and there’s lots of ways to be mindful, maybe she switches up her practice a little bit, and tries journaling or tries meditative coloring or maybe we use that cooking example earlier that let yourself sleep and let yourself be present, have some grace and gratitude in that, and try again.
Mike Domitrz:
Well, that’s just it, there’s nothing wrong with the sleep, ’cause it’s the end of her meditation, maybe that’s what she needs, may be she’s tired and she needs sleep, but she did the meditation, and that’s what they’re missing, they’re just joking that, “Hey, she’s napping, that’s her form of meditation.” But there’s a myth out there for a lot of people that that’s why I bring it up. A lot of people think, “If I do that, I‘m gonna fall asleep.”
Barry Moniak:
The teacher that I was studying under with the esoteric training, she had what I thought was the rather interesting analogy, she said, “Sometimes, you can update your software, and the program stays on. Sometimes, it says, we have to close the program to do the update, and then we’ll bring the program back online.”
Alan Anderson:
Good analogy.
Barry Moniak:
And that was interesting. So, maybe that going to sleep was allowing the wiring that that network that connects the brain to the mind to make some changes, so that we can look at things, listen things and do things differently.
Mike Domitrz:
I love that.
Holly Duckworth:
Well, that’s good.
Mike Domitrz:
I love that Barry, that is so cool. So, to wrap up here, what for each of you has been a myth of mindfulness that’s impacted you, in other words, that’s been a block at times during your lifetime, in being mindful?
Alan Anderson:
Hi, this is Alan again, if I may speak. I’m just gonna go back to what I mentioned before, ’cause this just come up to me a lot, is I think not knowing how to work with your own emotionality. For me, I can really feel that, if I’ve been emotionally hijacked, then it becomes very difficult for me to even apply meditation or mindfulness in any way. So, that’s a big one for me I think.
Holly Duckworth:
Well, Mike, that’s a good one. I think for me it … I’m not doing it right or I’m not doing it enough, or I’m not spending enough in my formal practice or I’m not spending enough time in my informal or applied practice, and for me it just continuously reminding myself that I am a [nash 00:28:16], my practice is perfect, whole and complete, and go with that flow of life. We know that grass doesn’t grow year round. There’s times that my practice grows really really great and there’s times that my practice slows down, and being in the flow with that in those times of, “I’m not enough,” might support some of our listeners as well.”
Barry Moniak:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Mike Domitrz:
Well, but I think that’s when people really fall into that judgment of how I’m practicing mindfulness.
Barry Moniak:
Yeah. For me, because of my empathic nature, my emotions have always been anywhere from huge to ginormous I just feel so much, and it could become debilitating at times, ’cause I wasn’t able to process it, didn’t know what to do with it, couldn’t understand it. And I started studying and actually got to know a number of special forces and when I was talking to a navy seal commander, I asked him why in all the books and literature and movies, we never hear about emotion? And so, are you guys more like spark on Star Trek, you’ve learned how to suppress it enough, that it doesn’t get in your way?”
And he said, “No, that nothing could be further from the truth, the emotions is where the instinct and the intuition live, we need that razor sharp.” I’m like, “Okay, well then I don’t get it,” And he said, “What we learned, is the more that you focus on the emotions, the more you exacerbate them. The more the mind focuses on the body, and the body focuses on the mind, that’s where the emotions will be in the best place possible.”
“So, what it really comes down to at that level of performance, is what does the mind think about what’s happening with the body, and what does is the body doing about what the mind is thinking? And that’s where they came up with the mind body, not mind emotion body, emotions will come along just because they’re there, it’s the relationship between the mind and the body.”
So, his suggestion was, whenever you see somebody who’s emotionally out of sorts, zoom the camera back and you will see a mind and a body that are not communicating well. And so, that’s become something that I’ve learned to live with. When I start to feel emotional, I step back and start thinking about what’s going on physically and what am I doing physically to handle whatever I’m dealing with mentally, and I feel better.
Mike Domitrz:
I love it. I wanna thank each of you for an awesome show this week, and for everyone listening, that’s Alan Anderson, Barry Moniak and Holly Duckworth, you have been listening to. Yu can learn all about each of them and our entire brilliant cast at everydaymindfulnessshow.com, once again, that’s everydaymindfulnessshow.com and until next time, may you enjoy every day mindfulness in your life.
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Key Takeaways:
[1:42] Mike asks the CAST “What is the biggest myth you hear surrounding mindfulness?”
[11:07] Using images to portray mindfulness.
[18:17] What is mindful work?
[23:25] A common myth is meditating is napping.
[27:15] The CAST shares mindfulness myths that have affected them.
Mentioned in This Episode:
Emotional Intelligence, by Daniel Goleman
Alan Anderson is a long-time mindfulness practitioner, and teaches to a wide range of students from children to adult; from Harley-Davidson cohort to a tent full of 200 Buddhists. He is the founder Windhorse Retreat Center, Arts & Mindfulness for Academic Progress, and teaches through Arts@Large, Growing Minds, and Shambhala International. Prior to this, he was a professional jazz musician for 20 years and toured and recorded with Paul Cebar, playing your basic New Orleans musical gumbo.
Holly Duckworth, LSP, CAE, CMP. A nationally recognized author, speaker and coach for leadership and mindfulness. She works with stressed out leaders to create profits, peace, and presence in uncertain times. Holly is a regular columnist for several publications including MeetingsNet News, and writes regularly on the future of leadership for Science of Mind magazine.
Barry Moniak brings insightful experience and profound discovery to his entertaining, interactive presentations. He inspires audiences to embrace a “befriend fear” mindset to build focused, energized, synergistic winning teams. Known affectionately as the “CEO Whisperer,” Barry gets leaders to not see people as they think they are, but rather as they truly are. He identifies operational strengths and weaknesses and creates a “befriend fear” modus operandi. This is the foundation for an extraordinary, winning, synergistic culture.
The Sponsors of This Week’s Episode:
Zen Parenting Radio — A podcast to help you feel outstanding.
Yes Means Yes: An Introduction to Consent and Boundaries a book for young people by Christine Babinec.
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